Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

paleotn

(21,542 posts)
19. It's complicated.....
Sat Dec 27, 2025, 12:58 PM
Dec 27

Supply and demand still works. Oil as a global commodity is bigger than a rapidly aging, orange bloviate who may not be around tomorrow. This is an industry that thinks overall in time frames much longer than our usual weeks and months. Decades in some cases. And Donnie is but a blip in that time frame. He may be gone next month or in 6 months and the whole DC paradigm changes. Who knows? Certainly can't plan long term based on his rapidly diminishing longevity.

Oversupply right now is a function of ....

- Improvements in fracking. US oil producers have gotten extremely good at squeezing more oil from fields that would even be considered 20 years ago.
- Global economic downturn, partially driven by tariffs interrupting global trade. Strip away the AI build out craze, and the US economy isn't doing too well either. Lower economic output means lower demand for oil. If there's a pull back in the AI build out, it's going to get ugly.
- Canadian tar sands going gangbusters at $70 + oil that's well above their comparatively high cost per barrel. Heavy oil feeding the US market whether Donnie likes it or not. Also, Canadians can't talk about climate change without a lot of embarrassment.
- And OPEC, particularly Saudi, making up the difference for much of Russia's oil being off the market due to Ukraine. There's debate as to how much the shadow fleet can even transport. Probably not much compared to pre-war levels. But it's something and that keeps Russia's war economy somewhat afloat. Ukraine smashing up Russia's oil infrastructure is certainly a serious poke in Putin's eye, but it doesn't really impact the global oil market all that much right now. If Ukraine does a deal, Russian oil may be back on the market in mass. Oil prices aren't just a measure of where we are now. They also contain a guesstimate of where we're going.
- And expansion of the EV market and its obvious impact. Even Toyota, who initially wanted to stick with hybrids, is going full tilt into EVs.

Oil is down now, but not for long. As prices decline towards various producers cost per barrel, the players will turn the spigot down. They can't afford not to. Profit makes the world go around, so fill your tank up now. It ain't going to stay at these levels for long. For purely selfish reasons, I hope it spikes again just in time for the 2026 elections.

The driver here is cost...

- US fracker's cost per barrel is ~ $40 to $50. Get close to that threshold and they're making no money and can't service their debt. They do not want a repeat of the 2015 bust or the covid debacle.
- Saudi has the lowest production cost of anyone, but that doesn't take into account what that regime needs to keep its populace placated. They need something around ~$70 to $90 per barrel and they've had to tap debt markets recently to keep their budget solvent. MBS can't afford this for long and he'd like to be around long after Donnie is worm food.
- Canadian tar sands is perhaps the most expensive to produce and they are not the least bit happy with this slide in price. And it's their heavy oil that feeds US refineries that were designed to use it. Venezuela produces heavy oil too and that's what's driving Donnie and his minion's focus on them. Do a regime change, drop the sanctions and they can get Venezuelan oil back on the market, directly benefiting the US. But the industry as a whole will react less than favorably, turn down the global spigot and we're back to $70 to $90 oil. But that's cause and affect Magats don't fully understand.

As I said, it's complicated. So enjoy for right now, but don't expect it to stay here for long. Some interesting takes...




Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Also there are a lot more crisis speculators now than back in the day. marble falls Dec 27 #1
Here's an interesting observation PJMcK Dec 27 #2
Gas taxes are also significantly higher in Europe. MichMan Dec 27 #5
Gas taxes are high in Pennsylvania. gab13by13 Dec 27 #8
Not even comparible MichMan Dec 27 #9
I'm not comparing taxes in the US gab13by13 Dec 27 #12
The post I specifically replied to said "In Europe, gasoline is significantly more expensive." MichMan Dec 27 #14
Monopolies multigraincracker Dec 27 #3
He is giving away our tax dollars to big oil in subsidies. Emile Dec 27 #4
Yes, that's what I am trying to say, thank you. gab13by13 Dec 27 #7
The price of oil and gas is complex Botany Dec 27 #6
At 69 years of age, last week was the very first time that I was dismayed at paying too little at the gas pump. Ferrets are Cool Dec 27 #10
People are missing the point I am trying to make, gab13by13 Dec 27 #13
Your assertion might be right. Igel Dec 27 #15
Yep. dalton99a Dec 27 #11
Not disagreeing, but more mathematical sentences for clarity would be nice. Tetrachloride Dec 27 #16
Here just north of Houston it's $2.13 at some places. Igel Dec 27 #17
2.79 in STL. 2.54 at SAM's in STL Pas-de-Calais Dec 27 #18
It's complicated..... paleotn Dec 27 #19
If that was the case, you would see a sharp decline in profits this year compared to previous years, but you don't MichMan Dec 27 #20
Agree, disagree. hay rick Dec 27 #21
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»More Proof That I Am Righ...»Reply #19